Best Overall "Major" Car Company

[Sir_GT]

Originally Posted by brembo Originally Posted by Refefer It's good that they can compete on all levels, but so can DC, Ford, and GM, and pretty much all the others. If you think of American cars there are no way it can compete with VAG or pretty much any other Euro brand of some standard.... Not because the Euro cars are so much better, cuz they are not, but if you put your clean nice ass in a Audi or other euro car of some standard and then into a (Insert AmCar here) there is no way the build quallity or quallity feel can compete the same with Asian cars.... Thicker plastics doesnt mean its more luxurious than the ones with thiner plastic interior....... Originally Posted by Refefer In terms of sports cars and super cars, I don't disagree that they win hands down... but what about the rest of the market? Their huge weakness is in their cheaper(lower priced) cars/econoboxs. With the exception of the Golf, they don't have any particular good sub 20k cars... and even then, the Mazda3 wins hands down over the Golf. They also lack in the cheaper sedan market: the cheapest I've seen of any sedans of reparable quality is the Jetta (which this year's model is supposed to break down a bit too much) and Audis. With the price exception of the Jetta, the cheapest Audi runs about $25k for it barebones (the A4). For that much cash I can get a full option Mazda 6 which many people say is the best sedan available. They got the rest of the market covered too my friend..... Im not sure you are aware of the brands included in the VAG family...... for the cheaper cars they got Skoda and Seat and of those two...Skoda got cars in the upper mid class when it comes to luxury and still they are cheap for what you get.... Seat got small sporty cars wich is cheap..... both brands got the same great engines as Audi got and the cars are buildt at brand new factories with every modern gizmo available........ dont forget that there is a tax on foreign cars wich gives the domestic an advantage...... I know the Mazda 6 is a good car my father got one and its much more sporty than you would expect from Mazda......no argument BUT it doesnt give me that warm and fuzzy feeling that I get from a nice Euro car its kind of without soul........ Originally Posted by Refefer Since you included SUVs, I think I will add trucks to the argument. Ford trucks are the best in the world. The F-150 and its many models has earned too many awards to type. Practical, well priced, and better than any of the competition. We also have Jeeps... yeah. If you think of the world as the US you might be right, but even if you guys call your baseball league the world series its not really the world series you know....... I like the F-150 its good looking and some of them goes like stink......however its a truck and holds often not more than two persons I wouldnt compare it to SUV`s....I dont like either of them...... For trucks it might be up there, but it cant hold a candle up to the tuareg at the end of the day....... Yeah you got jeeps its sad..... Originally Posted by Refefer In terms of engines, they have gotten a lot better than Ford's early years... and they sound oh so good (though that doesn't really count). The new rotary engine used in the RX-8 is a masterpiece of design, a big step forward for that type of engine. The engine's in the new mustangs have gotten good reviews over all, so I think the advantage from VAG over them is a bit slimmer. Im not saying VAG are a ocean away on every front but thats not the question either, even if the VAG engines are great machines..... the point is VAG provide a car in the top part of the list for every segment they sell cars in and for every car the competition comes up with they got a car to match it if not beat it........ oh and did I mention Vorsprung durch Tecknik’ ...................

You write a good argument, but most of it is based on a best case scenario... one which leans towards the VAG end of the scale.

No doubting that, overall, VAG builds good cars (I would choose an Audi over a Merc, or a Murcielago over pretty much anything out there in the £160,000 price range), but VAG's sheer size is both their boon and their bane.

You can't, for example, expect to have Volkswage compete with Audi. The Phaeton was a horrible move, and so was the Passat. Nobody is going to pay that price for a VW=badged car, and that's the bottom line. If the Phaeton was badged "Audi A10" or something, I bet you it would have sold by the bucketload. Instead, they tried to step above Audi, and ended up falling flat on their face.

You can't, also, expect Skoda to compete with VW. You already have one budget brand, complete with the Polo et al for the real cheap end of the market, so why have another company compete directly with you? Throw in SEAT and their line up, and you have three companies competing directly with each other, even though they all belong to the same parent company. Why cannibalize YOUR own sales when you should be focusing on your competition?

You also can't expect to share parts with your top end marques (such as Bentley, Bugatti, Lambo, etc.) and your bottom end ones, and not expect people to notice. Talk about eroding brand desirability.

BUT... even with that in mind, they are still a far better company than DaimlerChrysler or GM business-wise, arguably on-par with Ford, but lag behind Toyota.

This may sound stupid, but if there was one company that is going to become a model for brand management, it is going to be Fiat, especially with Luca di Montezemolo at the helm. They've got their products sorted properly, and it is that sort of proper brand management that VAG needs to learn from...

...but if they need a better example, BMW's just near their HQ anyway.