motor

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 06:45 PM

As far as I know if you change the cams you may want to go for fully adjusteable ones, also changing the cams alone is not going to give you that much power, you really have to change for lighter forged pistons, to bring the rpm redline higher thus having a broather power band, plus having a custom made intake and exhaust manifold, and then you'll start getting some serious power from playing with camshaft settings, in conclusion, changing the camshafts changes the whole way an engine breathes, and it's power band, it really depends on what use of your car you want, a really aggressive camshaft will give you better high end power, but the low end torque will suffer....
If I were you I would go for a turbo...not to many changes in engine configuration to get more power and then, if you really want to have some serious output new camshafts and exhaust will do the trick...

gis · 09-28-2003, 06:54 PM

turbo = drooooooool,but unfortunately,the insurance company will send me the big hand down the phone and giv me a good bitch slappin for bein so stupid for even askin,lol

all i would really want,is just a little bit more ummmph,i know its stupid sayin that in my car,but the car is fun in and out of corners,id like it to be that little bit more fun.id be happy with aiming for a 15-20hp gain,maybe little bit more if possible.

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 07:39 PM

Heheh, I see what you mean about the turbo, I guess I didn't thought about it that well...heh
ok, here's what you can do, chips, usually car manufacturers derate their engines by the means of chips, in order to have lower fuel consumption and emisions in detriment of performance, so, it depends also on the engine, the other thing is...Camshafts, even though they may be tricky, if you raise the redline to 7500 rpm's you can get some good extra power with some good tweaking and not necessarely neglect the low end power...obviously, not having a continousely changing camshaft, you will sacrifice some low end torque for some high end power...it's just up to you to sacrifice some "driveability" for some performance..

TT · 09-28-2003, 07:52 PM

But I'm not sure if I'd go with a chip rising the redline.. even if only 200 rpm... it would be better something rising slightly the peak power (same redline) and improving the midrange power and torque...

gis · 09-28-2003, 07:54 PM

hmmmmm,id love a 7500rpm redline,that be sweet,that would be 1300rpm raise from what it is now.i dont really wanna lose some low end torque,as thats were the most fun is on the saxo,in and out of corners,and if u mean by drivability losin handlin on the car,i dont wanna do that either as the handlin is funny and great on it.

i dont want to be spendin a fortune either on the car,when i think bout it,whats the point of goin crazy on mods with the VTR when the faster VTS is there.after tryin my luck racin a VTS,the key word in that bein TRYIN,i thought,shit thats much quicker,and i didnt want to be spendin shit loads just to get equal performance of a stock VTS,u know what i mean?

TT · 09-28-2003, 07:59 PM

You make me remember a very nice feature years ago in evo

They were testing "basic models" against top of the range.. you know, a Miata 1.6 and a 1.8, a Saxo VTR and a VTS, and giving you the list of mods you have to do to the "poorest" brother to make it visually like the big brother LOL!

And obviously the VTR - VTS was the best couple, the VTR beeing exactly the same car.. the just stated you need some VTS and 16V badges

But I guess that's not what you're searching for

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 08:04 PM

As Clarkson said, if you want to tune a car to make it fast, you better start with a fast one to begin with...
I'm just giving ideas though to get more power....
I beleive your engine is the 8v 1.6 liter...so, it's normal that it has more mid range torque and kinda runs out of breath at high rpm's, I think if you are going to change the camshafts you definetely need to change the redline, otherwise it's not worth it...
I meant driveability to the fact that you don't have to get to 3500 rpm's to get some decent acceleration of the red light...like a honda...
So, in conclusion, it's temptating to tune your car, it's fun...but...think about what you're starting with and if it's worth it...maybe with the money you save you can start with something fast...thus with more potential..

gis · 09-28-2003, 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by TT

You make me remember a very nice feature years ago in evo

They were testing "basic models" against top of the range.. you know, a Miata 1.6 and a 1.8, a Saxo VTR and a VTS, and giving you the list of mods you have to do to the "poorest" brother to make it visually like the big brother LOL!

And obviously the VTR - VTS was the best couple, the VTR beeing exactly the same car.. the just stated you need some VTS and 16V badges

But I guess that's not what you're searching for

sounds like a nice feature,do u have that scanned in dude,id like to see it,if u dont mind

who knows maybe with the VTS badge and 16v badge,i may gain the power difference between the VTR and VTS from that,lol

fedezyl,yes it is a 1.6 8v SOHC, i know what your sayin and it does make sense,i appreciate the info your all givin.doing any serious mods on the car,really,puts me in a class of stupid because money goin into it to make it quicker will basically just get me to the point of a stock VTS,i really just want some simple mods,maybe help it breathe a little better,around the country lanes,2nd and 3rd,and lil bit of 4th is what is best,and in 2nd and 3rd its when its more fun so id liek just that little extra hp to just m ake it a little bit more fun as it will be a little longer b4 a true faster car can be had in my possesion due to insurance reasons and things im doin and sortin in my life b4 earnin some good money.but helpin me get this VTR that little bit more fun is what im aiming for.

when the VTS comes along,then i could make it fast by of course,the route of forced induction

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 08:48 PM

Cool, I get your idea...
thing you can do yourself, by a new filter, K&N or something like that, now...do kind of a custom job that you can do yourself, try to get some sort of ram air intake, or help your filter get some fresh air, you can use some tubes and do it yourself, for cheap, the other thing would be a catback exhaust....if you can get it for cheap get a custom one, as well as a new muffler, that should do the trick for some 4-5 bhp...

TT · 09-28-2003, 09:00 PM

Hehe, new filter + custom works to make it have more hair are the mods I had in mind when I wrote about messed up dyno graphs...

A guy I know, owning a Civic VTI did something similar, installing a "manifold" to take more air right to the filter through the fog lamp hole.. and well.. with it, yes, the peak power was higher, but on the lower revs the car is completely killed.. if he closes the custom manifold, power and couple at low revs are higher than stock, but higher in the revs, it has less power than stock... so basically, it's not easy to do something like that in the proper way.. and you'll have to try to change a little, put the car on the dyno, see the result, change another little bit and so on, untill you get the wanted result...

gis · 09-28-2003, 10:09 PM

custom ram air,sounds good but from what TT said seems complicated to get workin right.i dont really wanna be messin around with the range of power throught the revs,i mean,the car isnt exactly a rocket ship now,lol.i dont want it to be slower from a stop.

hemi_fan · 09-28-2003, 10:22 PM

O man, this is very... very sad. The highest vehicle Horsepower posted on here is 150? 9.9 0-60? lol, anyone got a Ford Taurus, or maybe a Plymouth Voyageur with 200hp? Right now my dads Honda Pilot owns you all... 245hp, not sure on torque. The thing is geared pretty low so the 0-60 should be pretty good for an SUV, i woulnt be surprised if it was in the 7-8 second range. Someone has to have something powerful around here. Wheres Jabba and his exotics? lol

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 10:30 PM

I though that a longer manifold lenght for the intake benefits low end torque and a short one for high rpm breathing, that's what they did in my car, a series of valves open and close depending on rpm's and throttle load, so at full throttle the short intake manifold is used, and more torque is produced...I don't have the dyno chart's here, but i'll post them soon..
Also, on the ram air effect, it depend's on the intake manifold design, I know on Mooney Airplanes, they had this manual valve to activate in flight, a ram air valve, that would give the engine an extra Inch of manifold pressure, and on the newer models it's only a 1/3 of an inch...wich is nothing, so it really depends on the design of the manifold to take advantage of the ram air effect
..

gis · 09-28-2003, 10:31 PM

yeah but u gotta remember were either first time drivers like myself,with my first car and no money and people who have either no money coz they are students.insurance is another factor,u come to the UK and insure your car and i promise to take u to the hospital after u had heart failure from shock

fedezyl · 09-28-2003, 10:46 PM

well about the two cars you mentioned, the Honda Pilot and the Voyager, both yes have good horsepower, but they are also very heavy, power is not as important as power to weight ratio, if you want to see something fast with 156 bhp look at the lotus elise, and you'll see what I mean...
And I agree with gis, most of us are young, thus without money and high insurance costs...so low BHP cars....for now...