Man arrested for going 147mph - in a Hyundai Sonata

[ZfrkS62]

Originally Posted by Mattk Fact: Man caught driving at 147mph. This is way over the speed limit. Caught by camera, which is in good working order (after all, no-one else has complained yet). Fact: The car isn't supposed to be able to go that fast. However, according to the camera, it did. It is hard to prove that the camera wasn't tracking the car (the onus is on the defendant). As much as the Pargo bloke can argue that the car just can't go that fast, it is difficult to argue against actual facts. He was speeding. He was clocked at 147mph. My decision, if I were a judge, would be to fine the bugger. Keep in mind policy arguments: it would be in the driving community's interest not to have crazy people driving cars at dangerously high speeds. Dani, of course he will walk. Who the heck gets jailed for speeding?

No, burden of proof is on the prosecution. All the defense has to do is cast a shadow of a doubt and they win. Of course, being in Australia, you can't be expected to know that.

The car cannot physically do 147 mph. Case closed. You cannot beat physics, and physics say the drag on that car keeps it from breaking the 140 mark. Even Troy McLure could win this case

And in AZ, double the speed limit is criminal speeding, and you can be jailed for it

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Mattk Fact: Man caught driving at 147mph. This is way over the speed limit. Caught by camera, which is in good working order (after all, no-one else has complained yet). Fact: The car isn't supposed to be able to go that fast.

I thought you were captain of the debating team or sumfink?

How can a "camera catch" you? The camera simply takes a picture - that is all. It is NOT a speed measuring device. The camera is TRIGGERED by a speed measuring device --- which was obviously faulty, as is measured a speed that was not physically possible to be attained and then triggered the camera to take a picture..

See if the picture is used as "evidence" then the case is lost - as the evidence is obviously missleading and not applicable. If the "speed measurming device output" is used as evidence, it is obviously FALSE as the device "measured" a speed not possible.

:roll:

Originally Posted by Mattk My decision, if I were a judge, would be to fine the bugger.

Which is why you are not a judge (even though you play one online )- your grasp of the legal system seems to be zero...

[ZfrkS62]

[quote="666fast"]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by Mattk Simple - the camera shows his car, but the radar may have been tracking a low flying squirrel. Thats exactly what got the red light cameras here shut off! LOL He'll walk from this, they say he was going faster than the car can actually go, any judge that wants to keep their job would tell the prosecuters to shove it.

i just rememberd what triggers these cameras is not radar, but two sensors spaced a certain distance apart. they then use the time x distance=speed method to trigger the camera. I think someone forgot to carry a 1 when calibrating The red light cameras around Phoenix are triggered the same way.

[666fast]

[quote="ZfrkS62"]

Originally Posted by 666fast Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by Mattk Simple - the camera shows his car, but the radar may have been tracking a low flying squirrel. Thats exactly what got the red light cameras here shut off! LOL He'll walk from this, they say he was going faster than the car can actually go, any judge that wants to keep their job would tell the prosecuters to shove it. i just rememberd what triggers these cameras is not radar, but two sensors spaced a certain distance apart. they then use the time x distance=speed method to trigger the camera. I think someone forgot to carry a 1 when calibrating The red light cameras around Phoenix are triggered the same way.

I honestly don't know what triggered the ones we used to have. Or should I say, still have but can't use. It was ruled unconstitutional as the burden of proof is on the state and all they have proved is that your car went through a red light, but not who was actually driving.

EDIT- my editing of a quote in my original post has really messed up all quotes afterwards! heh cool

[RC45]

Originally Posted by ZfrkS62 i just rememberd what triggers these cameras is not radar, but two sensors spaced a certain distance apart. they then use the time x distance=speed method to trigger the camera. I think someone forgot to carry a 1 when calibrating The red light cameras around Phoenix are triggered the same way.

A gatsometer?

Well - if they are buried in the road surface, 2 adjacent cars can trigger the sensors and give a false reading - if they are beam sensors 2 adjacent cars can trigger them again giving a false reading - pretty much why gatso based systems are most likely to fail the old smell test in court.

DO you know what the trigger sensors are?

[Mattk]

Thinking more about this, I recall an instance of some truck driver who was caught driving at a speed beyond what his truck was capable of. The judge could interpret that precedent narrowly and say "well, I'll just do what he did".

However, this fails to take into account other factors, like the fact that this bloke is a serial speedster, the fact that people speed on this road all the time etc. The whole thing would probably come back to public policy. Most judges have views on this. Should a mad speedster get away with speeding on a narrow interpretation of a precedent? Probably not. Why? Because it is not in the public's interest to have such people on the roads. The judge will probably manipulate precedents to get what he wants.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Mattk Thinking more about this, I recall an instance of some truck driver who was caught driving at a speed beyond what his truck was capable of. The judge could interpret that precedent narrowly and say "well, I'll just do what he did". However, this fails to take into account other factors, like the fact that this bloke is a serial speedster, the fact that people speed on this road all the time etc. The whole thing would probably come back to public policy. Most judges have views on this. Should a mad speedster get away with speeding on a narrow interpretation of a precedent? Probably not. Why? Because it is not in the public's interest to have such people on the roads. The judge will probably manipulate precedents to get what he wants.

What proof will you use to "prove" the serial speeder charge?

You have failed to use any piece of the legal system as designed - you simply made shit up like a kangaroo court judge... you are trying to be the judge not the prosecutor - your job would be to adjudecate not prove guilt... wtf????

....oh wait... kangaroo court...

...nevermind :roll:

[sameerrao]

Great publicity for Hyundai wouldn't you say. I drove a 2005 Sonata from SF Bay Area to Grand Canyon, Vegas and back about 2000+miles in all.

I think I got it up to about 120 a couple times. The car is a bit too spongy and marshmellow-like in feel - I wasn't too comfortable above 100mph in it

[Mattk]

Judges are some of the most opinionated people you'll ever meet. Most are arrogant and like to flaunt their authority. They'll twist the law any way they can. Seriously, two different judges will be able to offer a different verdict on this case, and both will be 100% legal and 100% right.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by Mattk Judges are some of the most opinionated people you'll ever meet. Most are arrogant and like to flaunt their authority. They'll twist the law any way they can. Seriously, two different judges will be able to offer a different verdict on this case, and both will be 100% legal and 100% right.

Judges adjudicate - they don't prove guilt or prosecute.

Its a good thing then that this chap could have a jury trial - as you seem to subscribe to the kangaroo court method.

[ZfrkS62]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by ZfrkS62 i just rememberd what triggers these cameras is not radar, but two sensors spaced a certain distance apart. they then use the time x distance=speed method to trigger the camera. I think someone forgot to carry a 1 when calibrating The red light cameras around Phoenix are triggered the same way. A gatsometer? Well - if they are buried in the road surface, 2 adjacent cars can trigger the sensors and give a false reading - if they are beam sensors 2 adjacent cars can trigger them again giving a false reading - pretty much why gatso based systems are most likely to fail the old smell test in court. DO you know what the trigger sensors are?

they are pressure sensors that are set beneath the asphalt, much like the sensors used to trigger the stop lights. That's as much as i know for sure. As far as i can tell, there is probably a dedicated circuit for each lane.

[TNT]

^^ its a magnet not pressure common mistake

[Mattk]

Its a good thing then that this chap could have a jury trial

Trial by jury for traffic offences? Back here, they're brought before a stipendiary magistrate and it's over quite quickly.

[RC45]

Originally Posted by ZfrkS62 they are pressure sensors that are set beneath the asphalt, much like the sensors used to trigger the stop lights. That's as much as i know for sure. As far as i can tell, there is probably a dedicated circuit for each lane.

What happens if 2 people change lanes.. the second sensor could be triggered by a 2nd vehicle *shrug* - either way these triggered time difference gatso's are quite unreliable.

[ZfrkS62]

Originally Posted by RC45 Originally Posted by ZfrkS62 they are pressure sensors that are set beneath the asphalt, much like the sensors used to trigger the stop lights. That's as much as i know for sure. As far as i can tell, there is probably a dedicated circuit for each lane. What happens if 2 people change lanes.. the second sensor could be triggered by a 2nd vehicle *shrug* - either way these triggered time difference gatso's are quite unreliable.

I've never like the idea of them except for red light runners. In that instance they work really well and are very rarely unreliable since it is a network of 2-3 cameras which capture the face of the driver, the license plates, direction of travel, and speed.