motor

jon_s · 10-05-2003, 09:02 AM

Yo yo yo!! I have finally got round to doing this!! Ok, this is how it goes:

There are several things you can do:

1)Exhaust
2)Manifold
3)Induction Kit
4)Cams
5)Ecoteck Valve
6)Power Boost Valve
7)Chip

1) There is so much choice out there!! Basically GMC are the best...contanct no. below. However, there are lots of others out there. Main point...go for a full system. Not just the back box. You would be looking at £200-£300 I suspect.
2)Ok there are two types of manifould for your car. Firstly 4-1 and 4-2-1. From what I have read, 4-1 is better for the VTS and the 4-2-1 is better for the VTR. Reasons: 4-1 is better for the higher torque/RPM range, and the VTS makes the most of this. The 4-2-1 is better for the lower torque/RPM range, and the VTR takes advantage of this. For a manifold to work correctly the length and bore size is critical, unfortunately most exhaust manufacturers do not follow the requirements they just join the 2 up the best they can, having wrong sizes or wrong lengths can make the engine LESS not more powerful, all GMC manifolds are made technically correct. Miltec were charging over £200, and their specs were wrong, but it looks better!! Personally I would go for a GMC 4-2-1, you will see power gains from it. A GMC manifold costs £160 plus £30 for a fitting kit. You can ring GMC on 01671-403606 (the bloke there is also a Rally Driver, and does know his shit!!) to purchase one, as well as some friendly advice! You cannot order it online, as too many people order the wrong thing. They prefere to have a chat to make sure that they are selling the right product!Also, I believe that your cat is in the manifould, so, you would have to get a cat back exhaust to pass an MOT. without the cat you would be looking at around a 10bhp increase, with a cat exhaust, you would be looking at arouund a 5bhp increase. Oh and without a cat, the car is a lot louder--Something to ask GMC--.
3)Right Induction Kits!! rule one don't get a cheap open one i.e a K+N 57i...they are all sound and no go....even less go on a hot day! You need an encloused induction kit to see some real performance increases. You can get a 'Green Encloused induction kit', BMC enclosed, also the piper ViperX. You will be looking at £200ish. You can get the Green one for £160 including post I believe from a company called S-Link. Unfortunately I don't have a contact number. p.s Demontweeks is very expensive. Also have a look on e-bay.
4)CAMS!! Oh yes! You know the prices already. You were worried about getting any increase....well, if they are the first thing you do then you wou't see much! However, if you have sorted out the breathing of the car, then you will. When I put CAMS on my car, I was really disappointed, as I saw very little in terms of gains...and they were the last thing I did. Reason...........ahhhhhhh, a little matter of running them in! After around 2-3k the engine losened up, took it back to the dyno and my little baby was pushing an extra 8bhp over the original increase 6bhp...so in total I got an extra 14bhp.
5)Just an aside: there are various debates going on about an 'ecoteck valve'. For the VTR I have heard that they can increase responsiveness at around 3000rpm, and improve fuel eco! Not bad for £60. Some people will disagree, but have a look into it.
6) These cost around £100, and are needed after CAMS have been fitted to increase the fuel pressure. pre-CAMS, you will see no difference at all!
7)Chip, I could not find a lot of info on a chip. In general it should be around the last thing you do...as it adapts to all the mods that you have done (especially CAMS) Unfortunately Chips are beyond me. I can't tell you how they make the car better, it just does lol. But they respond best after engine mods. Looking at around £100-£200 again.

Overall!!! Agruments..is it worth spending all that money?? Errr..probably not! But then I did, and I am happy with the results. A VTS engine transplant could also be on the cars....but I doubt you will go down that route. Basically, the 3 main things are the 1)manifold 2)Full Exhaust System 3)Enclosed Induction Kit. You will notice the difference with this. In fact you will notice quite a lot of difference! As for the rest. Go for it if you want to.....JUST REMEMBER THE RESALE VALUE OF YOUR CAR!! The more you do, the less it is worth, and the more the insurance will be!

Hope this helps dude!

BADMIHAI · 10-05-2003, 12:24 PM

You're really something, Jon! I'm sure ol' Gis will appreciate this! BTW, Gis, are you thinking of moddin the ol' Saxo, or are ya gonna buy a VTR?

TT · 10-05-2003, 12:25 PM

Originally Posted by BADMIHAI

You're really something, Jon! I'm sure ol' Gis will appreciate this! BTW, Gis, are you thinking of moddin the ol' Saxo, or are ya gonna buy a VTR?

LOL he already has a VTR

1zippo1 · 10-05-2003, 12:34 PM

There are multiple Saxo VTS models (I don't think there's a VTR, that name is only used for the Xsara).

- The 1.4 75hp
- 1.6 100hp
- 1.6 120hp

TT · 10-05-2003, 12:34 PM

The 1.6 8v is called VTR

The 120 hp 16v is the VTS

1zippo1 · 10-05-2003, 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by TT

The 1.6 8v is called VTR

The 120 hp 16v is the VTS

Ah, I could be mistaken, but I checked a car mag and all saxo(with the body kit) 1.4 & 1.6's called VTS in there.

TT · 10-05-2003, 12:40 PM

Ah, it's possible that sort of things change from a country to another.. but here, in France and in UK afaik it's the same

VTS is the top of the range, VTR is the baby sister

same for the new C2, having only the VTR so far and VTS coming only in 2005 I think

jon_s · 10-05-2003, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by BADMIHAI

You're really something, Jon! I'm sure ol' Gis will appreciate this! BTW, Gis, are you thinking of moddin the ol' Saxo, or are ya gonna buy a VTR?

Cheers dude!!

jon_s · 10-05-2003, 12:42 PM

Doh!! lol, I just quoted myself, instead of editing! lol

1zippo1 · 10-05-2003, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by TT

Ah, it's possible that sort of things change from a country to another.. but here, in France and in UK afaik it's the same

VTS is the top of the range, VTR is the baby sister

same for the new C2, having only the VTR so far and VTS coming only in 2005 I think

Indeed, like the Peugeot 206 GTi 180 in the UK is the Peugeot 206 RC in Belgium.

TT · 10-05-2003, 12:49 PM

Exactly, or the Clio 172 in uk beeing Clio Sport here

and so on

.
.
.
I hope gis will come soon to put the discussion back on topic

BADMIHAI · 10-05-2003, 03:37 PM

I think Gis won't be coming in today

He seems to be away . Anyways, I meant the VTS! Sorry folks, I haven't lived in Europe in the last 2 years, so I kinda forgot some of the model styles and details

gis · 10-05-2003, 05:08 PM

WOW,thank u so much for that info jon i really appreciate it.those 3 mods you mentioned doin seem to be the best as i just want to gain as much power with less as i can really,not bein cheap,but like u said,thinkin of the re-sale value,which will be pretty crap now the C2 VTR is out.but IMO the saxo is the better lookin car and the gearbox in the C2 VTR just doesnt attract me,no clutch either.the filter i was thinkin of getting b4 u wrote all this was the pipercross VIPER,it will gain power with it and IMO it looks very sexy in the engine bay

those 3 mods u said,u think thats the way to go then?

BADMIHAI - yes i think i will spend the money on those 3 mods,at least i hope so,as insurance in the UK (as jon will know) is one bad thing to get,i been hearing rumours off other guys here who have saxos that they will now not insure young people on the saxo VTR till age of 19 so in january when insuring comes round again i may not get it,so a different car may be in order,been lookin at some other cars.but spendin loads of money and thinkin bout re-sale value may be a bad idea,she has just passed over 60k miles on her now 60,007 to be exact,lol

ZIPPO - theres a lot of variations of the saxo under different names from a 1.1 petrol,1.5 diesel,to 2 different named 1.4 ones called the furio and i cant remember the other at this time,lol and the 1.6 8v 90hp VTR and the 120hp 1.6 16v VTS,the VTR actually had a facelift after 1999 and came with a 98hp engine not the 90hp.

jon_s · 10-06-2003, 08:11 AM

The Viper is a good induction kit, and you will see an increased performance! When it is combined with the exhaust and manifold, the car will feel a lot better. Good luck with it all! 8)

gis · 10-06-2003, 10:02 AM

thanks mate.i appreciate your help

i was speaking with 666fast last night and he found me a very interesting website about a supercharger for the VTR and VTS and the power increase from the supercharger alone givs the VTR (without intercooler) a jump from 90hp to 142hp,thats without any change in exhaust,filter,cams etc etc,

now i had the idea for future mods on a VTS and the supercharger for the VTS without the intercooler givs it a jump from 120hp to 225hp and again,thats with just the charger,no other mods.it says the VTS has a power increase of 73% between the rev range of 4000 rpm to 7000 rpm.with the other mods it says an increase of about 65hp so with the charger it would have roughly 290hp.

this has me thinkin,when insurance is cheaper for the VTR i may buy another one,and get the supercharger for that with increase to 142hp from the charger and 75hp from the other mods rooughly makin 217hp and a 43% power increase between 3500rpm to 6000rpm,were the funs at IMO

what u guys think of that?